a peek inside the fishbowl

29 Jan, 2011

This week it was about Architect D.

Posted by andrea tomkins in: Home/reno

First, some housekeeping. Thank you to everyone who’s entered in the Love Your Body giveaway so far. I am really enjoying your entries! Also, as you may have seen here yesterday, I was part of a social media show on ‘A Morning’ yesterday, along with Stephanie, Melissa, and Lisa. It was really fun. You can watch my segment here. (I’m not going to watch it. I can’t watch or listen or read myself after the fact. What’s done is done!)

Everyone at ‘A’ was fantastic to work with and it was a memorable day. As always, after the tiny segment was all done (I think it was five minutes) I thought of a zillion things I wanted to say about BLOGGING. Egads. Someone needs to have me on an hour long phone-in show. With a panel. Who wants to join me? :)

This morning I woke up thinking about the reno. I first talked about it here. It’s something Mark and I have been talking about a lot, although it hasn’t bee reflected in the blog very much.

Oh my god, it’s all so overwhelming.

My first issue is this: why hire an architect, and not just a builder who offers design services?

If you ask an architect they’ll tell you that an architect is eminently qualified. Years of experience in design and traffic flow etc etc. They’ll say that builders (who may have “designers” on staff) don’t have the same qualifications.

If you ask a builder, they’ll say that an architect overcharges and is just a superfluous member of the team.

Mark and I went to the Home Renovation show at Lansdowne last weekend. First of all, can I say this, I hate paying for trade shows. It’s like a mall charging you admission so you can have the privilege of shopping. We could have saved two bucks per entry by buying our tickets online ahead of time, but apparently we had to give a whole bunch of personal information in exchange. Is four bucks worth a years of junk mail and telemarketers? No.

We wandered the aisles looking at countertops and picking up brochures for everything under the sun. At one point we stopped to chat with a well-known company that does renos and additions. Mr. Negative freaked us out about several unforeseen issues, like the possibility of there being asbestos in the stucco. Maybe he was doing us a favour by opening our eyes to some things we hadn’t considered, sure, but he went on to trash-talk architects. “We have a design team! You don’t need an architect!” We walked away from him feeling worse than when we started out. I still think it wasn’t very professional of him to badmouth people who work in his industry, no matter what he really thought.

Another person (not at the trade show) told us about kickbacks between architects and builders. And what if the architect comes in with an estimate that’s really low, and then we hire a builder who ends up blowing our budget?

All of this freaks me out to no end. Who do we trust?

It’s times like this I wish that I had been raised to be a contractor. Or we had a more solid connection to someone in the building industry.

We met with Architect D last week. (I’m not sure if I’m going to be using names at this point in our process, so this will have to suffice for now.) It was pretty exciting and nerve-wracking.

We liked him very much. He was very professional, a total straight-shooter, and understood that we weren’t made out of money. (I wish we were!) The first thing he said to us that we COULD consider selling our home and moving out to Stittsville. We’d get more house for our buck out in the sticks. For example, look at THIS house. On first view I liked so much that I fleetingly considered country living.

I know that our dollar would go much farther out there but it would break my heart to leave Westboro. I love it here so much that I’m doomed to stay.

Once that was out of the way we gave him a quickie tour (it WAS quick, because our place is so small) and gave him a general idea of What We Need To Do. Our emphasis was (hopefully) on smarter use of living space and storage, while maintaining true to the character of our home. We don’t want a huge home, we want an efficient and livable and lovely home. And closets.

It is obvious to me that we have a wish list that’s as long as my arm and a budget that does not match. The question is, can we end up with a renovation that will make us happy that does not require us to work until we’re 75? (I would be 75, Mark would be 85 for the record.)

We asked Architect D the builder question and he said that we wouldn’t need an architect if we were planning on building a simple one-storey addition right off the back. Our needs are more complex, he said, traffic flow and all of that. I have to give him that. He’s been doing this for almost 30 years. I have a rough idea of what we want but need a lot of help planning it out. But still, it’s hard to know what to do. He doesn’t come cheap.

He’s coming back to us with papers in the coming weeks and we’ll have a clear idea of a breakdown of costs. As much as we like him we need to set up a couple of others to talk to so we can compare.

Anyway, whatever route we decided to take, the reno will be crowdsourced here on the blog. :)

My first question to you is about bathrooms. Our plan is to build a 3-piece bathroom in the basement. There’s already a powder room on the main floor and there’ll be no change there. The second floor bathroom needs to be updated in the reno. Would you opt for an ensuite bathroom off the master bedroom (toilet, sink, walk-in shower) AND a separate bathroom for the girls (toilet, sink, tub/shower) … or one very large bathroom, very possibly with separate commode – Euro-style – which appeals to me GREATLY.)

Here’s my question: I realize the girls will be teens some day, but do four people really need four bathrooms? Do I really want to be cleaning four bathrooms until the end of my days?


23 Responses to "This week it was about Architect D."

1 | Kaitlin

January 29th, 2011 at 1:01 pm

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Four people do not need four bathrooms. When I lived in Germany, I had a host brother (15) who I had to contend with. Some of us showered in the morning, some in the afternoon.

Yes, you lose the opportunity to take nice, relaxing baths on a frequent basis, perhaps. But, you don’t ‘need’ 4 bathrooms. Or even three. Two? Two is a good number.

My parents have three bathrooms and it’s just the two of them. It’s a bit funny, really. Mind you, because they never use one, they only have two to clean ;)

If I were in your shoes, I would go with an en-suite and a separate one for the girls. A friend of mine has two brothers and this is what their parents did and there wasn’t any fighting over it.

2 | Alison p-h

January 29th, 2011 at 2:09 pm

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Andrea, I would recommend three bathrooms, not four. We were five growing up with 2 full bathrooms and it worked out. In the end, our schedules were never the same. The crunch time is just in the am. And that you can work around.
Good luck. I will be interested to hear of this venture!

3 | Alison p-h

January 29th, 2011 at 2:15 pm

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PS. Great job on A-Morning!

4 | Sara

January 29th, 2011 at 2:21 pm

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Definitely no need for four. Another way to think of it is with your budget. Making the space into 2 bathrooms would require more plumbing and more bathroom stuff as opposed to one large bathroom – one toilet etc.

Look at other alternatives – when my partner eventually build on our block of land, we plant to get a shower with two sprouts – multiple tasking!! Maybe that is an option too.

5 | Laura

January 29th, 2011 at 2:40 pm

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Your renovations sound very exciting. I watched your interview and you were FANTASTIC. Congratulations! :)

6 | Liisa

January 29th, 2011 at 3:32 pm

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I think the bathroom situation depends on your budget. But if I was a someday-to-be teenage girl, I wouldn’t want to share with my dad, and come to think of it, my mom probably wouldn’t have wanted to share with my teenage self.

As far as architects go, I think it depends on what you’re looking for and how much you know about house building. We were very concerned about flow and use of space so we used an architect. We have a lifestyle that doesn’t fit with the traditional house plan (both adults work at home). We also do not know a thing about house building so we wanted someone to oversee the project who had an interest in it being done according to plans and could make sure there were no corners being cut.

The thing to remember about architects though, is they are artists, and sometimes they work at their own pace.

7 | binki

January 29th, 2011 at 3:41 pm

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4 bathrooms? Seriously?

For 90% of the humans on our planet, two bathrooms would be “luxury”.

8 | Vivian

January 29th, 2011 at 7:42 pm

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Have you considered doing a ‘cheater’ ensuite upstairs? That is, a larger main bathroom that you can also enter into directly from the mater bedroom.

I’m interested in your architect experience! We’ve got many ‘someday’ plans for our 50+ year old bungalow, and we plan on hiring an architect so that we have a plan of attack for the multitude of projects.

9 | meanie

January 29th, 2011 at 7:51 pm

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we are a 4 bathroom family, in a bungalow, and it is a luxury yes, but a highly recommended luxury. having two girls, when i want to retreat to my oasis, i don’t have an aneurism over dirty socks/underwear/shampoo leaking everywhere. it’s my place (okay, my husbands as well) and i think it is one of the only places i don’t get interrupted. i say do it.

10 | DaniGirl

January 30th, 2011 at 7:39 am

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Ooo, I’ll be following your reno posts with great interest. I totally sympathize with the sentiment you expressed about trust — we’ve had more contractors come through this house in three months than in seven years at the old house!! Some have been gems, some dogs. It’s terrifying to put so much money and blind trust into someone for something as vital as your *home*.

On bathrooms, we are actually considering, in the 5 – 10 year plan, on blowing out the wall between the two-piece ensuite off the master bedroom and the main bathroom. The main bath is in the centre of the house, so gets no natural light, and the ensuite is large for a two-piece but not big enough to add a shower. Making a super-sized spa bathroom with separate shower, tub and commode area with a cheater door to the master bedroom would be a reasonably easy job.

And, even with a family of five I don’t think we’d need more than two bathrooms.

I’m collecting contractor recommendations, and now have a great plumber, electrician and mould remediation crew if you’re looking for names. ;) Actively seeking a drywaller, handyman and someone who can cut a door into an interior wall!

11 | FireMom

January 30th, 2011 at 8:50 am

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I have desperately wanted my own (uh, with the husband) bathroom for years. BUT, I like the idea of one BIG one with separate toilets.

12 | Judy

January 30th, 2011 at 11:29 am

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I grew up in a house with 4 bathrooms, sort of. My parents had a tiny three piece ensuite (shower), there was a family bath with toilet, sink & tub, a two piece for my grandma (we were a mulit-generational family – strong opinions from my mom & I how the reno would have differed!) and a powder room on the main floor.

Growing up as we all entered our teens, a bathroom in the basement would have made all the difference. Even if it was just a two piece.

So, while we had 4 baths, they weren’t the most effective four bathrooms. We had three adult and three kids. Essentially, the kids and the granny all shared one tub/shower. Made for interesting times getting out of the house.

I would say skip the ensuite and let the bathroom basement belong to the kids as they get older.

13 | Hilary

January 30th, 2011 at 12:01 pm

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My parents looked into adding an ensuite to their old, traditional Westboro house. Because of issues with the pipes that are behind my comprehension, the cost would have been insane. For that reason alone the contractor told them not to bother – they’d never make the money back upon selling. I know you’re looking at this as a lifestyle reno, not an investment opportunity, but I’d still go with one, lovely large bathroom upstairs. Maybe Mark can retreat to the downstairs one and have his own man bathroom – that’s what my dad did ;)

14 | Capital Mom

January 30th, 2011 at 1:33 pm

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I have a very good friend that is an architect if you are looking for more people to meet with. She used to work with a very well known firm but now she is starting out on her own.

15 | lacoop

January 30th, 2011 at 5:11 pm

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This is so timely for us. For the past couple of years we have entertained reno ideas. The money is a concern, but the thing that is stopping us from moving forward is the fear that we won’t get an honest, competent contractor. I know there are lots of honest contractors and lots of competent contractors…but there are also the crooks and the incompetent that ruin it for the good guys. For that reason alone we have not got on with out ideas. Recently, someone told us about renomark.ca, which is supposed to be a site to find contractors who have to meet some type of criteria. We will investigate this renomark.ca further…perhaps they will be the place for us to find enough confidence to get on with things. We will be watching your site to see how things go with your plans. Good luck!

16 | Carrie C

January 30th, 2011 at 6:10 pm

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Can I third the ‘cheater’ master suite?

We are doing something similar to that. We have a 2 bedroom bungalow, and are in the process of renovating the basement to include a new bedroom for us.

We purposely built the bathroom with 2 doors; one entrance is through the bedrooom, and the other is accessed through the hall. It is a large bright space with a walk in shower (no tub) that takes advantage of the natural light from the window above the shower.

As far as renovation advice goes – research, research, research. Get references, ask to see portfolios, make sure you SEE the permits that are obtained for any work, ask to see proof of all the pertinent insurance and liability coverage and make sure the contractor knows you will check in on the work frequently.

Any contractor that isn’t comfortable with you being around during the work is a contractor you don’t want to work with.

As far as details go, make sure you have all your materials/fixtures/layouts chosen, ordered and on site as soon as possible. Special order items can take weeks to come in, and without them, a job can be delayed. Know that last minute changes to the plans will be expensive.

Build a contingency into the budget for surprises, as they will happen. Even with the best architect and builder, things will come up that you will not be prepared for. Once you start opening up walls, it’s amazing what you may find.

Good luck with the project!

17 | Tiana

January 30th, 2011 at 6:58 pm

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Option B for bathrooms for sure.

Using a builder is great if you already have design skills and know exactly what you want done and just need someone to execute it. Using and architect, or even an interior designer (they are licensed to do construction up to 3 storeys and may cost you less) is great if you know what your needs are, but don’t know how to implement them.

Full disclosure – I say this as an interior designer.

Also you can sometimes find an Arch. or ID. who will also take care of project management thus the builder becomes their sub and are accountable to them for staying on budget so you don’t need to worry about that.

18 | Chantal

January 31st, 2011 at 10:50 am

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I grew up in a family of 5 with two bathrooms. One only had a bath in it and the other only had a shower. So basically we all used the shower one daily. My sister and I (both teens at the same time) did our hair and makeup in our bedrooms. Since we had two toilets there was rarely a fight for the bathroom and we all adhered to a schedule of who showered when and for how long. It is doable.

I now live in a house with 3 bathrooms, two full and one half, and I find it excessive. Two full bathrooms on the second level is more than is needed and I have often considered getting rid of one, but it would affect resale and we do plan on moving.

19 | Mandy From Nova Scotia

January 31st, 2011 at 2:54 pm

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We live in a house with 4 adults and 2 children and have 3 bathrooms and the 3rd rarely ever gets used. I just have to comment on your house in the sticks, what a gorgeous house but I almost had a stroke at that price I didn’t realize prices in ON were soooo much more than in NS we have a house ah hour away from Halifax the capital of NS it’s two whole houses like a duplex but different with two kitchens, 5 bedrooms, two living rooms 3 baths and a partially finished basement and we paid $80 000 for it but since we only live in half and my mother and stepfather live in the other half we really only paid $40 000. That is a big price difference from what you guys deal with in On I gather. It’s to bad you don’t know someone who is a contractor that is how we have done our renovations at our place, my stepfather is a contractor and my husband is an electrician who works along side plumbers, dry wallers ect… so we had most of our labour done for free. But on the flip side of that I didn’t have anyone to help me with making my home flow properly or use my space to it’s full advantage which would have been extremely helpful. I can’t wait to see your before and after pics.

20 | Lindsay

January 31st, 2011 at 6:38 pm

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I grew up in a beautiful house that my dad built (he is a general contractor) and we had ONE full bath with a shower/tub and a later on a second 2 piece powder room on the main floor. I should mention that I have 2 sisters and a brother. That makes for a household of four women and two men. It was never an issue. Sure it was nice when the second bathroom went in downstairs for blowdrying hair and brushing teeth, but we managed totally fine!

21 | LO

February 2nd, 2011 at 6:20 pm

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I would do an ensuite and separate for the girls-great for resale and hey, when you don’t use it you just have to dust (when girls move out). But then again I am someone who somehow ended up with 5 bathrooms and no cleaning lady…sigh
Our new house somewhere out where your money gets more according to your post:) had every bedroom equipped with a bathroom…kinda neat until it’s time to clean!
Okay, as for the basement. At our previous home, when we finished the lower level we did not put in a bathroom for two reasons-money and space and we didn’t have a true bedroom down there (it has to have a window to be called a true bedroom). Forward to new house-when we finished the lower level we did put in a fab bathroom for a few reasons-the lower level is twice the size of the last one, is a walkout and has 9 foot ceilings and has a true bedroom….and for resale:) Funny thing – it’s the nicest bathroom in the house now:)

22 | Julie

February 4th, 2011 at 2:29 pm

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A great builder in the Westboro area (I’m a little biased). Current projects (with happy customers) on Brierwood and Fraser.
http://www.finespaces.ca

Good luck with your reno. It is stressful, but you are doing your research and that is half the battle.

Bathrooms. I like four. If you have the space, why not?

23 | Listy things and a return to reno land >> a peek inside the fishbowl

February 17th, 2011 at 9:49 am

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[…] you remember the bathroom discussion? I have read all of your comments and thought a LOT about our bathroom usage and the winner is: […]

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My name is Andrea and I live in Ottawa with my husband Mark and our dog Sunny who is kind of a big deal on Instagram. During the day I work as a freelance writer. I am a longtime Ottawa blogger and I've occupied this little corner of the WWW since 1999. The Fishbowl is my whiteboard, water cooler, and journal, all rolled into one. I'm passionate about healthy living, arts and culture, travel, great gear, good food, and sharing the best of Ottawa. I also love vegetables, photography, gadgets, and great design.

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